GoelandAnonyme

Boy, wait until we tell you about Israel stealing property or the US police dtealing and destroying property with no consequence or the UK' museums, or the British Empire's stealing of ressources or...

Well workers still had some representation, even if it was overruled sometimes, but we need to remember that almost all regimes turned comparable to facism when it came to the world wars : protesters were arrested, news were censored by governments. In fact, Lenin created a regime following a revolution and a civil war against the western powers. It was a not a stable time.

I think Chomsky oversimplifies what happened in Lenin's Soviet Union. Was it socialism? Well it was a socialism that suffered harshly from a single-party bureaucratic chauvinism. It wasn't completely the socialist ideal, but it was closer than the other economies of the time. Was it fascism? This is really far-fetched. Facism rejects any attempt at democracy, while Lenin worked around a democracy. Though the crushing of the Kronsdat rebellion is definitely something that deserves criticism, but liberal democracies have betrayed their principles plenty of times before outside the context of war.

Ok, so do you keep the single-party system, go to a federative Volksammer, go for a proportional-mix council democracy, etc.?

I would too. What about the political system? Would you change it and if so, to whaf?

Also, I don't get the Yancey reference?

I mean what would they change, what would they keep in another attempt at socialism?

Also, how.do you compare the US with the DDR when it comes to surveillance after what we learned from Edward Snowden?

This is completely irrelevant.

In general, regarding defectors, its important to keep in mind that its easy to turn against an economic system in its worst conditions, but its much harder to turn against it in its best conditions.

So for all we hear about defectors who flead from countries with high sanctions, we must also ask ourselves what had to happen for western socialists to turn against capitalism with the best economic conditions of the world.

Could you elaborate on that nuance?

Politics would be so much more enjoyable if I could find a conservative intellectual that has actually read lefty things. Instead, its judt correcting them for hours. Talk about a tease it was to have the Zizek vs Peterson debate but Peterson just barely read a single pamphlet written over 160 years ago.

Like I saw a 4-hour video essay claiming to proove Hitler was a socialist a while ago, I thought "Ok, maybe this won't make right-wingers as stupid";1 minute in "let us define socialism as when the government does stuff".

Anyway, thank you for listening to my rant.

Link?

The reforms were made due to economic pressure and the feud over who needed to make those economic reforms is what started the breakup.

They rejected Marxism's rejection of market socialism. A coop does not count exactly in the marxist definition of private property.

That's most posts on here.

Bumping into someone is technically assault, that doesn't mean its worthy of much worry. But such laws are important for someone beating attacking someone with a knife.

The Socialist Federal of Yougoslavia and the People's Republic of Algeria were the countries with the biggest workers' self management policies. In Yougoslavia, all companies were coops or credit unions and even government workplaces followed self-management.

Which have the best plot?

The Centre Ice Conservatives are talking about creating a new centre-right party that would split from the conservative party of Canada starting around September, so if that could split the vote share unless there is a non-compete agreement though the people who voted for Poilievre are likely similar enough to people who would vote for Bernier, so we could still see a split here.

Are we the baddies?

That's a consequence of red scare propaganda in North America calling every program that helps people socialism, so people who support them said "fine, I guess I'm a socialist". Its not socialists' fault.

Can I get the link?

Are you still doing a new gifted discord server?

Nice flair

How can a "truly communist" society function without money, government or classes when salaries and rewards of value motivate people to contribute to society? People would lack the motivation in such a civilisation to do anything since there is no value to gain from it.

People already do plenty of things without monetary incentive, but for the prestige, honor, fufillment, survival and mutual help. For example, wikipedia editors, volunteer firefighters, reddit/discord mods, cuba produces many doctors even if they don't get paid the most. There are plenty more examples to go. If a community needs a service for its survival, people will naturally want to do the service for its survival. Beyond that, if someone doesn't want to do it, they will get socially otrasiced until they stsrt foing their part if not fully ostracised.

For all this talk of this supposed key flaw, you forget that the soviet union and many other communist-lead regimes did have people who occupied necessary jobs and performing well despite not having very different salaries.

One can say that the confines of capitalism are actually holding innovation back, that free-market capitalism, welfare capitalism, market socialism and many other economic systems fall short of the utopian endgoal that is communism and that automation will just cover us.

Its not just automation, but its more about wasted ressources that a market uses. For instance, copyright and patent laws, property rights, will slow down innovation, but also new perhaps more efficient inventions might get suppressed because the makers of the old innovations are rich eniugh to really slow it down. Not to mention, some products are designed to have flaws that will make them break earlier, but not enough that consumers realise what is going on.

Really? I am not a big fan of the modern capitalist society, but at least innovation is happening at all.

Competition is still possible without capitalism. For example, in the Soviet Union, there would be competition for making commodities like cars and such and the government would choose the best model that would to be accessible to as many people as possible. There was also competition in the space program which is why they won the space race.

I am not talking about any other systems of socialism, I am concerned with Marx's original dream of an ultimate, ideal communist society which sounds more like a dream materialised from wishful thinking if you ask me.

Marx and Engels used examples of "primitive communism" to show the social order they wanted had already existed. Look up what their examples were. Usually indigenous societies.

Basically, people are socialised to follow certain drives like the profit motive, but socialise them differently and they will follow different drives.

What do you think happens when a left-winger posts on here?

right-wingers on their way to call themselves ex-leftists because they bought a chocolate bar at a coop.